The Don't Want Us To Remember This Stuff: The Great Cosmic Mother Pt. 2

Wonder how you got trapped in the machine?  We've got all the answers for you. Using our book of the moment, The Great Cosmic Mother, we break down how ancient goddess-centered cultures that were so real and connected through birth, death, creativity, ecstacy, and the earth - got totally crushed and rewritten with a patriarchal influenced monotheistic jealous god. The change coincided with a rise in conquering, violence, and a focus on production - a desire to change humans into worker bots to feed the machine. We know this really happened because the book has so many receipts and well, it's a culture that we still live in. 

Some episode highlights:

• using haiku as a quick grounding tool when your justice sensitivity flares up
• rejecting the straight-line patriarchal colonial story of history and progress
• evidence for nonviolent settled life and priestess-led religion at Çatalhöyük 
• how modern work culture steals sleep, dreams, and inner life 
• how Christianity repackaged woman/goddess-related symbols, including menstrual blood
• we learn that it was a fig tree that Eve and Adam ate from and quickly decide we aren't changing the name of the podcast

Everybody write a haiku and send it to us. 

Work less, sleep more, write haikus. Read the book.

Notes:

Fun short vid with CGM reading:

https://www.tiktok.com/@universetrip/video/7503218453923269918

William Irwin Thompson. (Joanna reads a quote)

https://williamirwinthompsondotblog.wordpress.com/

Zoey - Reads the Great Cosmic Mother

https://open.spotify.com/show/54FiACeQTVyz2RDPpovjIQ?si=1955c55d59c348bc

Cassandra Faye Floyd reads The Great Cosmic Mother

https://www.youtube.com/live/ZRu9YEwhWPw?si=ZXTickIZwz-wAojn

Credits

Recorded at Troubadour Studios in Lansing, MI

Audio Engineer Corey DeRushia

Edited by Rie Daisies at Nighttime Girlfriend Studio

Music: ‘Shifting pt. 2 (instrumental)’  by Rie Daisies

Executive Producer Kate ML Rogers

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Website

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Transcript

Existential Cold Open And Freestyle

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Don't you love how much the stuff in the Great Cosmic Mother they they're talking about like death and sleeping and woo we're like is go to the dirt. Just go to the dirt.

SPEAKER_03 0:11

Go to the dirt. You'll come right back.

SPEAKER_02 0:14

Go to the dirt. You'll be back in two shakes.

SPEAKER_03 0:17

You're already in the fetal position.

SPEAKER_02 0:19

You just gotta wheel yourself down. That's right. Greetings, dear listener, and welcome to Biting All the Apples. And you're about to ear witness a freestyle episode. Freestyle. Freestyle.

SPEAKER_03 0:36

We're freestyling.

SPEAKER_02 0:38

We record these a couple weeks in advance, and we are almost smack dab in the middle of, we're almost to the Ides of March. Ooh. And I I almost think I shouldn't mention dates because I'll be like, and you're hearing us from the beyond because we all died in a nuclear.

SPEAKER_03 0:54

I know. Um but yes, mention dates because like someone will find us. Someone will find us. And they'll be like, And rushing off the dust.

SPEAKER_02 1:04

Yeah, so we're I'm like, as you can tell by my stuttering, we're just doing this in full existential crisis mode. True. It's not even existential crisis anymore, it's full crisis. Yeah, in your face crisis. Right in your face. And we really think the best way to collect ourselves, because I don't even know if we'll have a music break. If so, put it right here. I'm Sarah Kay. I'm Joanna V. And we're here to not lose our minds by biting all the apples. Meaning we are getting all the fruits of knowledge, forbidden knowledge, hidden knowledge, fun knowledge.

SPEAKER_03 1:53

Yeah. Yeah. Go travel and learn more knowledge. Knowledge. Knowledge that leads you on the path to multiple knowledges. And then maybe spark some ideas for the new world.

SPEAKER_02 2:06

I love that. We're basically pioneers for your mind. Yes. At least for my mind. Who said artists don't thrive in chaos? Listen to this girl over here. So we're getting back into our book of the moment. Ooh, I like that. A little reminder. Season two is about we're kind of only doing a couple episodes on each book. We got a big old book right now. Oh my gosh. It's a they call it a tome. She's a big and so it's a giant book. And you know, we're all kind of losing it or whatever. There's a lack of saying that. As I'm saying losing it, we are totally safe right now. Yes. So just I'm not trying to be like this is from Bob's big space.

SPEAKER_01 2:49

Yeah. We're okay.

SPEAKER_02 2:50

But just, you know, the levels of institutional betrayal combined with like I said, I I'm having just a justice sensitivity flare-up that'll happen. Well, you know, it's causing inflammation in my entire setting.

unknown 3:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:06

Yeah. Seems to focus itself within like the heart, gut region. Well, the chakras. These chakras. Oh, yeah. Where you're from the throat. Your chakras are on.

unknown 3:18

I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 3:20

I love my little toe. This is my little tote bag. You know what I'm saying, ladies? My my chakras are resonating, but not in like a good way. More of like in They're flaring.

SPEAKER_02 3:30

We're kind of sick. I'm fl I'm flared up. I'm having a flare-up. And we hope that you too are flavored and if you're if you're having a flare-up, this could be an episode for you. Great cosmic mother. We talked about the intro uh last episode. Joanna gave great background info and authors. And we're getting into the the nitty-gritty. Yeah. We're getting into the fleshy mother part of all of it today. We're gonna talk about sections two and three. The um artifacts. The artifacts. There's so much stuff. We're not even gonna tell you, we're like, we'll never get to everything that's in here. But our goal is to expose some of the norm challenging information, because that's what season two is all about. Just to be like, hey, we've all been told this thing. Have you ever thought about it this way? And we're not telling you this is 100% the right way, but I'm gonna tell you, pretty darn interesting.

SPEAKER_03 4:21

Oh my! I bet it'll just make your synapses and like, oh, and maybe you'll go get the book because you'll be like, actually, I need to take a look see.

Haikus To Get Grounded

SPEAKER_02 4:32

Yeah, take a look-see. Get this book. It's everywhere. And we've mentioned that there are a couple great gals, a couple great peoples that have read this book. So we'll put those links in the show notes. So sometimes it is easier. Like, think about it, especially like nowadays. I mean, maybe it is comforting to sit down and read a 400-page book, or maybe you can't sit still. So listening, highly recommend. Highly. I'm doing both. I love, I love it. I love listening. So to ground us, I was telling Joanna that sometimes if I'm in a place, like I arrive someplace like a half hour early, and I was like, I'm going to just write some haikus. Oh, yes. So we're gonna start off to get grounded for this episode because we were having a little bit of like, okay, but this happened, this happened, this far this drip. And I was like, we need to haiku. Yeah, because we were not going to good places. Yeah, we're not going to good places. We want to go the haiku place. And everybody loves poetry. I'm less. They should if they don't. They should. This is gonna hit you right in your inflamed chakras. And these are like haikus. So Joanne and I are gonna read each other the haikus. We have not heard them.

SPEAKER_03 5:39

And actually, I felt a million times better after I wrote it. And we aren't we weren't allowed to share. So this is fun.

SPEAKER_02 5:44

When you hear ours, you're gonna be like, there's no way they wrote those just five minutes ago.

SPEAKER_03 5:50

But please know that we did.

SPEAKER_02 5:55

By the way, we just each have two, so don't like turn off the podcast.

unknown 5:58

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 5:59

Especially if you're not a poetry fan. And as if you're really not a poetry fan, haiku five-syllable, seven-syllable, five-syllable. Yeah. Haiku one. Spiraling with thought. What could be if we connect? Return to the womb.

SPEAKER_02 6:20

You know what? Yes. That is so cosmic mothery. And I love that we both wait, do you wait till you hear? I can't wait. Awesome. I was like, that was really good. Way to hear mine. What? What's wrong with me?

SPEAKER_01 6:34

I'm an emotional. That was good, but wait.

SPEAKER_02 6:36

Here's a better one. That was a good one. Like these poems are read in order of quality. It's true.

SPEAKER_03 6:43

It's true.

SPEAKER_02 6:44

The second one was much harder. I was just excited because we both were like spiral. Okay. I'm excited. Oh, really? Mm-hmm. Don't fear spiraling. We are destined to be big. The spiral is home.

SPEAKER_01 6:58

Oh, did that just get you? Oh, cosmic mother. Oh, great cosmic mother.

SPEAKER_02 7:06

Yes, girl, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:07

Oh, you got me in my spiral serpent. You got me in my my internal spiral serpent. You got me in my soul dragon. My soul dragon. Yes, I know. I kind of love that.

SPEAKER_03 7:24

Women are sacred. Not by choice, but by design. Creators of life. That could just that's it.

SPEAKER_02 7:34

That's our platform.

SPEAKER_01 7:37

Great. Cosmic mother.

SPEAKER_03 7:41

Mama, I'm coming home.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Our last haiku. I'm doing my Mike Myers Sorry, Mary, the axe murderer. Whoa, man. Whoa. Whoa, man. Whoa man.

SPEAKER_03 7:58

All in black.

SPEAKER_02 8:00

All right. Birth, death, rebirth, go. Beware man's endless straight line. Hold close what you know.

SPEAKER_03 8:11

Oh my god. That's really good. Do you like that one? That is my favorite. Oh my gosh, we gotta send it to a magazine or send it to. If there are any magazines left, we'd send it to you. Poetry's magazine. Where is it? Highlights for adults.

The Spiral Against Linear History

SPEAKER_02 8:29

That was my Oh, they could totally go into highlights for adults. Thank you. Thank you. That was really good. The reason that we picked this book is because it challenges the idea of linearity. Is that a word? Yeah. That's what is challenging this idea that we're supposed to be like everything in the past was just like primitive, crazy BS. And it is the it's very patriarchal to be like a straight line. There, and now we're even seeing this today. Like I said, Rubio and Miller, and I think Keg's brother, who I don't even want, but you know, everybody's referencing like we come from great civilization. And I'm like, we do, but I think you need to go further back.

unknown 9:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:16

I believe you stopped at terrible people. Right. And they want us to see, they want us to see the past as like super primitive. They they don't want us to know that all the time like civilizations rise and then fall back in, and it doesn't always go in a straight line. No. And that's what the great cosmic mother shows us that there were great civilizations before that had like really advanced technology for the time for different They had things.

SPEAKER_03 9:44

Yeah, they had things. They were doing fine. Okay. They were doing fine. They were working together, and it wasn't so primitive. Right. It's not so primitive. And things would have continued being good, except for people, power hungry people hungry. Conqueror era. Somehow they got charge. I just want to know who the first guy was like. Yeah, I think we need a ruler.

SPEAKER_02 10:12

Who was that person? Probably the guy who was the ruler. Oh, yeah. Just somebody who's like, I need to just take charge of this. This is a big old book. So it's not like we're gonna go over exactly chapter by chapter. We're just gonna we're gonna talk about a few points that really hit home. Um, section two, women's early religion, and then section three, women's culture and religion in Neolithic times. And remember the intro that we talked about last week says it's kind of like, and what do we do about it? So we don't know. Maybe the last section of the book talks about what you're asking. Yeah. Like when did this all when did it begin?

SPEAKER_03 10:44

Like and actually it's kind of an emotional read. It really is. Yeah. It's it's it is Especially nowadays. And and it makes you realize, like, oh, this probably did affect me quite a bit as a woman, and it's been affecting women for while I'm reading. I'm like, I should probably just like find a time. I need a visual one. I'm sure there's one that's what we should do. We'll be like, this is where they were man, chroman, man, crow man, and then we're dragons, Westeros.

SPEAKER_02 11:11

So yeah, work with some nicer way back when. And if we haven't given the disclaimer in a while, mind you, we are, you know, we are educated, we're thinkers, we're readers. There's a lot of stuff we don't know. I don't speak for Joanna.

SPEAKER_03 11:24

No, I you know I don't know a lot of things.

SPEAKER_02 11:28

But what we would really love if there's anything that you're like, come on, ladies, it's this and that. Like just reach out and let us know.

SPEAKER_03 11:33

Yeah, I found it interesting in the book, in these in this women's early religion, that they were like, women didn't really know how they got pregnant in the beginning. Right. I don't know how historians know that, but I mean it has to do with the artifacts and stuff, but it was very like miracle, which by the way, kinda is it is, yeah, it literally is.

SPEAKER_02 11:58

Yeah. And I'm use I use the term miracle not attached to bearded man in the sky.

SPEAKER_03 12:03

Yeah. And you know, I've always felt like as soon as I learned that the earth is 70% water and that I was 70% water, and by the way, I I think I was pretty old when that like settled in, where I was like, I mean, I'm sure I heard that at least. I hope. But when I was like in my mid-20s and I was like, I got very involved in the environment and I was very upset that we were ruining the planet, and the rainforest really blew my mind. But that 70%, 70%, like that I've always felt rooted.

SPEAKER_02 12:36

Like that's so weird that we're the same, like the planet and myself, like and this book goes further because in the simplest terms, like what you just said, you know, that you're like, it just makes sense. Like, we're our whole constitution is exactly like every other living thing, but that has been smashed out of us. And so reading about these religions where it was like that was the core, where they're like, We are of this earth, there's like no separation.

SPEAKER_03 13:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:13

I mean, so much so, and we can just skip around. Um, if the men would go hunting and some of the you know, if they killed an adult animal, if they killed an adult animal, the women would bring the babies back, bring the babies back and breastfeed them, sure.

SPEAKER_03 13:27

You know, it's nice if you found like a baby oxen and isn't that that ox is gonna grow up or you're gonna let it die.

SPEAKER_02 13:33

And like today, like thinking about that, we're like, that is fucking wild. But but if you were back then being like, well, yeah, it's a living thing, and just like I'm a living thing, I got a thing.

SPEAKER_03 13:45

Makes sense. Now we'd institutionalize someone. I actually remember a story about this a lady had a squirrel that she was breastfeeding.

SPEAKER_01 13:52

And I'm kidding, I bet you can look at us and say, I'm not even kidding. Not even kidding.

SPEAKER_03 13:59

I'm I mean, I believe like it was like a funny, but it was like, oh, look at that, crazy. And now I'm like, well, actually, quite nice of her. Right, quite nice of her.

SPEAKER_02 14:09

She can do whatever she wants. That's right. I mean, I want to keep I mean, I'm just I wouldn't. Here's the thing. Of all the things just like if we were like, let's get a little more back to this, I wouldn't start with uh animal wet nursing, but what do I know?

SPEAKER_03 14:24

But it was just to tell the beginning. It was really cool. Now that lady, I believe it was like a video, and she was probably on some, you know, man-made drugs. Right. But they did it to domesticate the animals. That was the beginning of domestication. And it was like way back, like we're living in caves, so right. Like it's not like you had a ton of neighbors, and you know. Yeah, you got a baby uh deer, and you can eat that deer later, or you're gonna keep it alive, right? Right, right. You're gonna suckle it. You're gonna suckle it.

SPEAKER_01 15:03

Look again. Anyways, okay, my children.

SPEAKER_02 15:05

I'm a child, anyways. We are childlike. It says in here that that's fine. I'm returning to the earth. There is oh my gosh, there's so much. There's so much good stuff. I know we say that all the time. We're talking about why it is so upsetting to read this because it actually does feel like something was taken from. It was. It's not like I'm saying we all need to just go live outside and make a home from like tree branches. That's not what I'm saying.

Venus Figures Birth And Female Power

SPEAKER_03 15:33

No, but it would be nice to be recognized for the wonders that we are, that we do hold within us, instead of, you know, being tried to be controlled. This is how far back they go in this book. Um 35,000, 10,000 BC. And they were finding Venus statues and stuff. What I thought this was nice is that though named after Venus, the Roman goddess of love, they were no longer seen by arch archaeologists as crow magnum sexual objects. They are magic images of the mysterious power of the female to create life out of herself and to sustain it. Which is uh magical. And as we know from reading the woman's Bible, the Bible taught that it was disgusting.

SPEAKER_02 16:21

It was disgusting. Is so what's clicking for me there is that is why they had to, you know, suppress this because and remember, even our disclaimer for reading the women's Bible, anybody that has under the illusion of certainty, and that is exactly what they don't like. Mystical, unknown stuff. And there's like and obviously it's very like women were very powerful and they don't have like a there's you know, it's unknown. It's not uncertain. So they're like, we need to change this into a certain world, which certainty is like that's not even like a thing. It's not a thing, but it's their idea of it on a rock for living in space. I found this interesting because she talks about um, so Western history does not show us any evolution toward greater spirit, greater meaning, or greater culture. Think about that. We all in history it is all more, it's about conquering in technology, right? The Western Roman Christian contribution to the world, when we look at it, has been almost entirely in the area of technology, of analytical intellect, combined with a notorious spiritual and cultural alienation, and perhaps the loneliest individuals the planet has ever seen. Mind you, this was written in the 80s.

SPEAKER_03 17:37

Oh my god, we're so much more lonely.

SPEAKER_02 17:39

So much, so much worse. What there still is of spirit, of poetry, of coherent meaning, of symbolic truth in the world did not come from us. It was there at the beginning among our Stone Age ancestors, and just from some other stuff that I've like read and know, is there's this is also why like Christianity works so well. They're telling us that all this spiritual stuff and these people of the earth are like, yeah, that's that's that was when that happened. No, that's remember it's all linear, so they're like, No, that happened. That's when that happened, and so we got it all set and we found out that it was Jesus, and now we're just gonna move forward, being like, we don't need to think about spirituality because we already we already got it back there, it was back in the back in this time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:22

So also other fun things. Even a lot of talk about how we were more open to sexuality, a lot of, you know, that there was no like thought about there was a lot of bisexuality and even the thought that because back in the cave days, they didn't they don't believe that the humans knew that the baby came from sex. Right. Right? They just thought, oh my and and the women wouldn't know they were pregnant until like I mean, there were no ultrasounds, okay? Right, right. So they would just know and they would think, oh, well, they're the breath of life has come from the wind or the water or wherever. And they're like, oh, the miracle is happening. So a lot of it is about birth because wow, what a miracle. And a lot of the drawings in the the super old drawings show the baby still connected by the umbilical cord. The men were probably like, Whoa, that's the thing. That's why I'm gonna paint that page.

SPEAKER_02 19:24

I know, that's why I'm like, if you think back in the day, that's why seeing all these pictures of just like straight up and and big ladies, which I want to get to too, like giving birth, like people must have been like, these ladies are where it's like this is where this is where they're all like this is where we're all coming from. And seeing the umbilical cord, that's amazing. Yeah, like really connected. Like we do not jam out on that enough. Now it's all like we're just they're in tiny little clothes rooms.

SPEAKER_03 19:52

Not that I mean, I don't want to give birth in front of a bunch of people, but you know, I'm just saying I mean the celebration and the awe, I guess. Yes is like this is life, like, oh my gosh. Yeah, and not only that, but they were very tied to the earth, right? So even in death, they would bury people in the thought that they would become again. Because that's they would come again.

SPEAKER_02 20:18

That's the other big takeaway from there. It's mentioned in a couple chapters, that relationship where they believed that that's kind of all the same thing. Like the birth and death are kind of the same thing. And did you read the part where um they talk about they found in a lot of ancient burial sites people were buried in the fetal position? Yes, yeah, just like you were in the womb. They're like, what they're like, yeah, so just go back. They're like, you came out of that lady's womb, so go back to this womb.

SPEAKER_03 20:45

And then they just so and they would cover them with stones with breasts, just covered. Cover them with boobies in case doing case you get hungry.

SPEAKER_01 20:54

I mean, my gosh, it makes the thing is so much sense. Right?

SPEAKER_03 20:58

Like if you were just like figuring things out, and then also if you if you were to ask me, like, where do you go when you die?

SPEAKER_02 21:04

I'm like, well, where were you before you got here? Ashes to ashes, like dust to dust. Do you know where you were before you got here? It's cool, probably.

SPEAKER_03 21:12

You're just like someplace cool, someplace else. Part of the Just go on back, girl. I mean, so everything does like everything like trees, right? They die. They f you don't want to pick them up because they go down and they create nutrients and they become something new. They become something they feed as well.

SPEAKER_02 21:33

Yeah. I think it was just yesterday I was like, I'm like, my quick summary of what I've read is that women were big and bisexual and powerful. And powerful. And the other thing they that is mentioned, and it's important to talk about that, like the s I don't know why I keep on being like they were that big. They were this big. But no, they were they they do talk about that, and it makes you think that it's no coincidence that. That coinciding on this linear progression, you know, that we've been on with the patriarchal society is that convincing women to be small and tiny and weak. Because yeah, and quiet. And I don't know, like I'm sure even men today don't understand that that that doesn't come from like oh manly caveman stuff. It becomes because you feared their power. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:23

And we were not because you're naturally bigger. We were pontificating how that happened. Like, did they starve them? Like these are things we're gonna explore further. Like no. How did the how did the shrinking of the woman?

SPEAKER_02 22:36

Well, I think essentially looking back on those times, they obviously women. I don't know if there was that big of a size difference in between men and women, because archaeologists have been wrong when they've found graves with weapons and assuming that those bones were for men because of the size. And now they know that they're a lot of those were women because they they assumed because of the size and them being buried with weapons, but now we know that women were hunters and warriors. Yeah. And equals and actually they might have been about the same time.

SPEAKER_03 23:15

Yeah. Size. Sorry. They were seen as powerful. Yeah. And I mean uh they said for 200,000 years, women were seen God was seen as a woman, and then like eek men to do it hasn't been that long. Yeah, it's not going well. It is not going well.

Peaceful Neolithic Villages And Modern Doubts

SPEAKER_02 23:34

Right. I had another little there's a chapter about the first um first settled villages. Here's I have a couple things to read. Just in case there's any curiosity here. Some of the oldest known settlements and the oldest known green sickle have been found in the area of Palestine.

SPEAKER_03 23:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:54

Turkey's like the seat of civilization. Yeah. Totally getting or totally has been blown to fuck. I yeah. That this the world is just friggin'. And then the other thing, and I just again this is written in the 80s, so there might be some updates. But in here she writes, Eric Fromm in the anatomy of human destructiveness, also that we should check that book out. That sounds good. Speculates on the meaning of this culture. And right before then she was talking about planting and harvesting and storage methods and healing. So, you know, we're talking about these cultures where you're like, well, all they did was just like heal and grow food. We're like, that isn't is that a real thing? Anyway, babies? Yes. So he says, speculates on the meaning of this culture, the fact that among hundreds of skeletons covering at least 800 years of continuous culture, not one shows signs of violent death. The fact that women seem to outnumber men and are buried with greater honor, the fact that the religion of Katal Huyuk, administered by priestesses, stressed the renewing and protecting powers of the great mother. That's better. But not one, not one had violent death. So just having evidence. Because any time, you know, anytime I try to talk to modern folks about not that I'm like, we just all need to go on a commune, but it's just anything. You try to like mention anything. Like you try to mention anything, even something as like, I shouldn't say lame, but as like soft as like democratic socialism.

SPEAKER_03 25:29

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:31

Which is like it'll never work. Bare minimum, like bare minimum of like just trying to write. So you just want to pay for people.

SPEAKER_03 25:40

You want to pay for the lazy people? Is that what you want to do?

SPEAKER_02 25:42

As if we didn't just pay$300 million for um lard ass to go golfing. Yeah. That's everything just shut the fuck up about like money and stuff. I saw somebody talking about Jasmine Crockett has three million. I'm like, literally, Christy Gnome gave her friends like a$200 million contract. Yeah, like people's concept of numbers where I'm just anyways, tangent. But um get in Yang. But oh, but if you mention anything about like these cultures that are really based more in like how can we have everybody thrive, you always hear someone say, like, yeah, well, somebody will come and try to like take it away or whatever. My answers to that are in like one, and be like, you mean like right now, today, that happens all the fucking time. Yeah. Like, yes. And two, I'm just like, you your brain's still you're like an imperialist mode, dude. Yeah. Like, but there are and sure, I mean, obvious, obviously, there's bad eggs all the time, everywhere, but like, wouldn't you rather be in a culture that is like the goal is for everybody to thrive, and then so together you could figure out what to do about the the bad guy. Yeah. Instead of just being like, be like, well, somebody try to take away. I prefer just elect a pedophile grifter to take care of things. Okay, genius.

SPEAKER_03 26:59

He's gonna pay for things, it's gonna be great.

SPEAKER_02 27:02

Yeah. I'm like, what do you that which is why we're doing stuff like this, and we encourage everybody to just read different ways where I'm like this is because the conversations, people have been saying the same shit about it as my thing. Yeah. Even like 30 years ago, they're like, Well, people will be lazy. Okay. Okay, then we'll just keep doing this. Yeah, because this is now working.

SPEAKER_03 27:27

But this seeing the history of where we were and how we looked to the skies more. It was just the whole relation to here we are in the earth. We need to respect this, we need to respect, and that they even thought of the earth as a woman, right? And that we don't not enough people we don't know if it's a woman, but like a womb or a life giver or well, they some yeah, certain cultures would have it as a woman, but as a human, the earth was a human just like we so we were like the same thing, and we need to go back to that not go back right like I don't want to be Cro-Magnon, right? But I want that respect back. I want that um reverence. Well, yeah, the reverence for the earth for the animals, for the earth, for each other, for each other. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 28:21

The big thing when we were talking about how just incredible it must have been, you know, see like women give birth. The main point is again, like men were totally a huge part of this, and but they watched that and they're like, oh, those ones with the boobs give birth to us, so we should listen to them. Yeah, yeah, like not like listen to them only, but like if they said stuff, you'd be like, Well, they probably know what they're talking about since that's where we like come from, which is super simplified, but it also is that simple and it's nuts how that is gone today. Women 100% gone. How long have women been talking about like, hey, we need child care? Yeah. Like, we literally so crazy. Don't listen to we literally don't listen to women today that say they need child care, like we literally don't listen to that. And people are like, I'm not paying for people's kids.

SPEAKER_03 29:16

And just from reading this stuff and being like, how did we get so off track? Like, I mean, really, there couldn't have been a lot of people that were like, we gotta control things. There's not a lot, because look at now, it's not a lot of people. It's just like this tiny, like, what is the flaw in in the DNA of humans that we were like, yeah, let's we probably should follow that guy.

SPEAKER_02 29:40

Like, probably because well, we probably went through periods where food agriculture was like scarce, one wealthy person had it, and they were like, Well, I'm gonna make some shit up. And you're you're gonna listen to me. Yeah. Again, I know there's a history. They're like, actually, this, but I'm like, yeah, please reach out.

SPEAKER_03 29:57

Yeah, reach out. We're making stuff up, but we're reading this. Honestly, the way that it affects me when I'm reading it is like I don't I didn't grow up valuing how what a miracle we are providing. Like, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 30:14

No, girls are raised to literally cover their body and like shamed if they even accidentally you're like 11 years old, they're like, You can't wear a tank top, and you're like, I don't like, I'm just trying to like live. I didn't even all of a sudden your own body is shame. And that's the first mode, and this is why they say like your mother's your first depressor, which is true. That but like that's your first mode of being like, yeah, it's an and also that's not for you. That's like you don't need to wear a shirt for your comfort, it's for other people's comfort.

SPEAKER_03 30:50

I just yeah, and even like the breastfeeding thing that went on for a long time, like to you had to hide breastfeeding. Bonkers, bonkers, yeah, like legit.

SPEAKER_02 30:59

Luckily, that if I would have read this book and I was like breastfeeding, I'd be like, Well, did you know? If women you're you're like, you're lucky I didn't bring in nine kittens as well.

SPEAKER_01 31:12

You're right. Because I can breastfeed anything.

SPEAKER_03 31:16

Anything.

Dance Menstruation And Stolen Myth

SPEAKER_02 31:24

Let me orient people real quick. So we're again moving through what chapter or section are you gonna be reading first?

SPEAKER_03 31:31

This is the mother of wild animals and dance, which it does talk a lot about like chimpanzees dance and they dance for different reasons and like how transformative dance is. They said commenting on the almost total blindness of male historians. So this is the the quote that William Irwin Thompson wrote. I don't know who he is, it doesn't explain it, but I thought it was great. Because we have separated humanity from nature, subject from object, values from analysis, knowledge from myth, and universities from the universe, it is enormously difficult for anyone but a poet or a mystic to understand what is going on in the holistic and mythiopic thought of the ice age of humanity. The very language we use to discuss the past speaks of tools, hunters, and men. When every statue and painting we discover cries out to us that this ice age humanity was a culture of art, the love of animals, and women.

SPEAKER_02 32:37

Shows you that's where the like we're talking about, the movie like anger, where you're like, it has been like erased.

SPEAKER_03 32:44

Ice age motherfuckers. Isn't that crazy? Why would why would we lost all the good things and now we're left with all the corrupt and like what did we used to say uh certainty? Yeah. The false certainty. That's what we're stuck with. I refuse it.

SPEAKER_02 33:03

I refuse it, I reject it.

SPEAKER_03 33:07

I know. And I'm going back to dancing and just hanging out with animals.

SPEAKER_02 33:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 33:13

That's it.

SPEAKER_02 33:14

I had this thing to read about science. This covers, it's almost like 20 chapters we're talking about. A lot of them are really short, and they're just gorgeous and so cool, and they talk about the different goddesses and like the looking at the moon as part of this three-part, you know, the three stages of the moon where it's like waxing and full and then and then waning and how that relates to birth, death, yeah. Your menses, and then how it also coincides with that idea of birth, life, rebirth, or birth, death, rebirth, you know, like that. All three three is always a number. Three or nine, y'all. Three or four. So no, what is up with that? That's what's up with that.

SPEAKER_03 33:53

That's what's up with that, right here. I'm just kidding. Did you so the way that we are connected, and they talk about the mencies a lot, and how, like, first of all, men were like, whoa, you can just bleed and you're not dying. That's great, great, right? But when the Jesus, and they do call it a fictitious, they're like the fictitious Jesus, but they used a better word. They used a fancy word. The apocryphal Jesus says, the whole on high hath part and our dancing, who danthus, I'm sorry, who dance this not knoweth what cometh to pass. So if you're dancing, you don't know the truth, right? But their Jesus, the cut, they were saying, like his wounds bleeding like a woman, right? Yep. So they were like, oh, well, let's make this guy, but let's let's add a list of some of that mystical stuff that women do, you know? Yeah. When they bleed and they don't die. Yeah. They come back to life, you know what I mean? Yes, and things like that. You know what I'm saying? Yes.

SPEAKER_02 34:47

Just there are there are so many parts in here where she they talk about how these things were picked up and put in the Bible. That and she even brings up, but they talk about Cain and Abel actually being about the Canaanites getting taken over by the Israelites, I believe. Is that the right to have that correct from our last season? Yeah. And then there's something about I gotta find the Adam and Eve thing. Pause. Oh, and there's stuff about like the bee always being a sign of the goddess, there's a spider mother. Oh yeah. I mean, there's stories. Another biblical thing is in Neolithic times, the moon and the stone symbols were combined into one characteristic shape, the horned altar. And then they talk about all the different gods and you know, horn Teutonic warrior women and the horn pan, pagan god of nature. You know, all these have horns. They're like belong to this tradition, and this is why the Christian devil is depicted wearing horns. Hello. It's all, and I'm trying to find this.

SPEAKER_03 35:47

There's so many amazing things, but also I love the pictures that are from like artifacts like 5,000, 6,000 years ago. That just makes me crazy. And I'm just like, oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 36:01

And what I learned about, because I'm like, well, what's like the opposition to this book? Because that's always good to know. And some archaeologists try to be like, well, we don't really know if if like those are supposed to be goddesses. And my point is like, well, one, totally could be, two, doesn't really matter because it still is like a female form that's like obviously they obviously liked um, yeah. They were they were fans, they obviously thought they were cool enough to be like, we should make some statues of this shit.

SPEAKER_03 36:29

Yeah, and I think the Egyptians women ruled first. They do talk about even the throne of the Egyptian ruler was actually a woman that he sat upon. Isis. Oh yes. And Osiris, the Egyptian book of the dead, which also I would probably like to read. Um we totally need to read that. I think add it to the list. I think I do.

Sleep Dreams And Capitalism's Grip

SPEAKER_02 36:52

And the Native American perspective. Absolutely. That's where I love the the Navajo like um spider gods.

SPEAKER_03 36:59

Can I read this, Nesla? Yes, please do, especially if you're trying to find yes. Obviously, things have been corrupted and it has been of great disservice to humanity. The Native Americans obviously were very eyewitness to that because obviously, and are still eyewitness to that because of what the colonists um did when they came to the Americas. But Samahala, Inez Pierce, who sang the primal truth to the white man's world of the 19th century, business and resource development oriented America. So these are his words. My young men shall never work. Men who work cannot dream, and wisdom comes in dreams. You ask me to plow the ground? Shall I take a knife and tear my mother's breast because of the connection? Then, when I die, she will not take me to her bosom to rest. You ask me to dig for stone. Shall I dig under her skin for her bones? Then when I die, I cannot enter her body and be born again. You ask me to cut grass and make hay and sell it to be rich like the white man. But how can I cut off my mother's hair? It is bad law, and my people cannot obey it. I want my people to stay with me here. All the dead humans will come to life again. We must wait here in the house of our ancestors and be ready to meet in the body of our mother.

SPEAKER_02 38:31

I almost don't even want to comment on that because I don't want to like that. Yeah, I may have already mentioned this. That very first part where he said, like, you don't need to dream, like the importance of dream. I took this little course on like the history of sleep, and and one huge takeaway was how capitalism has stolen our dreams because J-O-B, they do determine when you can sleep. If you really think about that, and that goes along with what we're saying, why this is so upsetting, because it's about crushing our inner like magic and power, and the very fact that so many Americans, and I remember I'm so glad it's out of fashion now, but when I was coming up in like the professional world, bragging about how little sleep people got was a fucking thing. And I will say I was never into it. Even back when people that was like a cool thing, I'd be like, I don't know why you think that's cool.

SPEAKER_03 39:28

So my nephew is I'm like, that's so fucking weird. Yeah, my nephew's in a profession. Okay, yeah, he's in a profession where if they so they get the young people to come in and work, but like you are working and you are on call to your and you need to come in and you might need to stay till 3 a.m. Yep. You're gonna make a lot of money.

SPEAKER_02 39:50

Just trade your whole inner power for it. I mean, could that be a more classic sign of like, you know, meet me at the crossroads type of situation? Yeah. And if you spend all, if you spend 40 to 50 hours a week doing stuff that you don't really give a fuck, what does that do to your soul? So many people would be like, yeah, it's bad. And then just be like, but that's just how we do it. That's how we do it. I gotta keep doing it. I'm like, these ladies didn't. No, those people didn't. Mm-mm. I like this freestyle episode. I'm like, I'm like, I hope you guys have enjoyed listening to us ramble.

SPEAKER_03 40:26

I wanna Mind expanded.

SPEAKER_02 40:28

Mind expanded. Let me just because we're always piggybacking off our last season and seeing how Christianity. Let me try. This is really fun. Seeing how Christian, that's all you gotta say. And um, and I know we can't cover everything, but they go into like yoga and movement and the whirling dervishes and like all the things.

SPEAKER_03 40:49

Everything in and out and the giving, taking, receiving.

Eden's Fig Tree And Final Takeaways

SPEAKER_02 40:53

And so in the Neolithic world, there's like a world tree symbol, which also reminds me of Nordic mythology where there is the single tree. Again, the name is escaping me. I don't hold that stuff in my head. It's a beautiful tree. It escaped. I need to go get an estrogen patch. Okay, anyways. The um in this is so I'm gonna read a little bit here. In the Hebrew Genesis, Eve and Adam, I think I should put Eve first. Oh my god, it's weird. That was weird.

SPEAKER_03 41:20

It sounded weird to hear it.

SPEAKER_02 41:22

That's horrible that it sounded weird. Yeah. Even though, again, our Victorian ladies last season in that book were like, Eve is actually the main character, by the way.

SPEAKER_03 41:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 41:32

Adam's just like, whatever. Um crybaby. He's a crybaby, threw Eve under the bus. In the Hebrew Genesis, Eve and Adam are driven from the garden of immortality by Yahweh because they consort with the cosmic serpent under this magic world tree. The Genesis tree was not an apple but a fig tree. We're keeping the name of the podcast still. Yeah. Okay, sorry.

SPEAKER_03 41:57

But all the figs.

SPEAKER_02 42:01

The Genesis tree was not an apple but a fig tree. Even Adam covered their nakedness with fig leaves after eating its fruit in Eden. Hathor, the cow goddess of Egypt, was anciently identified with the fig tree, which was known as living body of Hathor on earth. To eat of its sweet pulpy fruit is very vulva-like fruit, was to eat of her flesh and fluid. I'm never gonna look at the fig. Wow.

SPEAKER_03 42:27

It is very vulnike.

SPEAKER_02 42:29

Yeah, there's a lot of fruit that looks pretty vulva-like. Yeah, even yeah, yeah, right. There's a lot. I saw Call Me by Your Name. There's a peach scene in there. Oh, peach for sure. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Juice a peach. Juice a peach. The fig tree was also sacred on Crete, considered the food of eternity and immortality. The Biblical Garden of Eden was in fact the entire Near Eastern, North African, and Mediterranean Neolithical or sorry, Neolithic agricultural world of the great goddess, and the forbidden tree, an evil serpent, represented her ancient magic powers of illumination and immortality and earthly peace. So if you she didn't get kicked out? No. But think about this. This is what the Christians, or whoever wrote that fucking thing. Yeah. Already took an old thing. It almost so like modern day us reading that, we're like, it was a garden. These people that wrote it knew that they were talking, they knew that they were referencing like a myth fresh in their mind. So a tree meant something totally different, like the holy tree. Yeah. Just cracks it open a little bit.

SPEAKER_03 43:42

Yeah, it lets you know, let's in the light. It lets it in. Let's in those light to crack the certainty. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 43:50

Today we're like, it was the apple tree. Yeah. Didn't have a name. And the snake. Yeah, that's how it goes. It's like, no, that that body. The Bible was written as a little like jab at that stuff to be like that world is fucking over. Yeah. Wow. Your earth world is done.

unknown 44:10

Crazy.

SPEAKER_02 44:11

I like that. Do you like that?

SPEAKER_03 44:13

Wow. There's so many more things, but I guess we have to we have to wait until next week.

SPEAKER_02 44:18

We have more haikus to write.

unknown 44:20

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 44:21

I can't wait. Because actually that was that really was healing. So I recommend everybody. Everybody write a haiku, send it to us. Do it. It took us. I mean, that was like a good, sustained, but like enough to like but not long. No, but it it was a calming process. Yes. It had all the synapses, firing.

SPEAKER_02 44:41

People shouldn't really actually we should just communicate in poems because apparently just regular old language is failing us.

SPEAKER_03 44:49

People are missing. People are missing some pretty glaring things. Yes, yes. Maybe we're just using too many words. We gotta leave, like I was saying, the poetry leaves things open for interpretation for your dreaming mind. Yes. So our lesson today: work less, sleep more, write haikus. Write haikus. Read this book. Read the book. And send us your haikus.

SPEAKER_01 45:17

Oh my gosh, send us your haikus.

SPEAKER_03 45:19

Do a dramatic reading of them. Oh my gosh. Oh, that would be so great.

SPEAKER_02 45:27

Thanks so much for listening. We know there's people out there that have already read this book, or if you have questions, you know you can always reach out. Next week, we're going to wrap up this book. Oh my gosh, I'm so excited. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:39

Because it's going into I'm hoping that there's gonna be a step-by-step plan. They're like, and the buried treasure. I will tell you something. These people have the receipts because the notes with references are um in the bibliography.

SPEAKER_02 45:52

We could probably just start working through. There's oh my gosh, Joanna, there's a book in the bibliography called The Golden Ass.

SPEAKER_01 45:59

And we know No, we gotta get that one! Oh my gosh. I forget which Old Testament book the Golden Ass was in.

SPEAKER_02 46:06

That's so good.

SPEAKER_03 46:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 46:07

Oh, I love the Golden Ass and the White.

SPEAKER_03 46:10

I love white asses. The talking ass. All the asses.

SPEAKER_02 46:13

All the asses. Silly ass. So next, the last um section is called Patriarchal Culture and Religion. Isn't that gonna be a fun book? The very first chapter response. So we're gonna get the answers to every question. We may not even have to read another book ever again. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 46:33

I mean, here's the patriarchal beginning and the end.

SPEAKER_02 46:39

And the end.

SPEAKER_03 46:40

We're gonna sleep, dream, read. When we come back next week, we'll be there to enlighten you.

SPEAKER_02 46:45

Thank you so much for listening. And we will see you next week.

SPEAKER_03 46:51

Yes, we're gonna bite into this patriarchal apple.